Indigenous hip dances similar to Hawaiian Hula and Tahitian Hura found in Micronesia?



  • sorry Folu...was just saying a you could be right 
  • @rbrotha,

    Thanks again my friend for this educational exchange on Micronesian History. In regard to the misconception and the facts provided by Spaniards, that's exactly what I am trying to tell you. The supposedly facts you've been reading through have too much corrections and at some point it contradicted everything they said. We don't believe the Spanish Facts especially census report. They get caught in trying to fix their numbers too much to better display a better explanation and better number to down play what was really happen in Guam. A lot of data are still floating around with different numbers and assumption of what was the real number on the declining chamorros population. People can only imagine but the Chamorros weren't completely replaced by the Filipino and spaniard. Their culture and language was what completely changed, the Filipino dominated after the genocide and everything Science tested and thought were actually studied from Filipino descendant on Guam who are the majority. The population wasn't 50/50, it was less than that and yes they married the remaining woman and the very few surviving men were enslaved to labor work and I don't think they married and breed and if they did, it's most definitely a very little number and probably don't last at all to carry on a pure blood line of the ancient Chamorro. Remember, they convert them to christianity, these poor remaining children and woman and enslaved the men. They were forced to change their culture, started to wear dress and changing their language. Due to Filipino language similarity based on Austronesian roots, it's quite very easy for the little remaining pieces of what left of the pure blood chamorro to completely transform into the First migrated population of Filipino. Also, before Filipino men brought over to Guam after the war which went on for years, there were already Filipino Couples, Filipino Men and Women who came as escort, translator and assistants to the Missionaries. The Language Scientist study on Guam and the DNA were studied and extracted from pure blood Filipino who are no called and speak a new language we know of as Chamorro surviving language.

    When the few remaining Chamorros were forced to transformed to the way of life of the new residents, or the invaders, they tried to change and applied the same onto the newly arriving flock of the Caroline islands. The Carolinian refused and didn't agree to it so they were relocated to Saipan and the other islands to farm and work but mostly for isolation due to their differences.

    What the Spannish documented and thought were the old language of the pure blood chamorros were already the similar based on Austronesian roots from the newly migrated Filipino and that's why the Caroline islanders like me are able to relate and tell the Chuukic continuum resemblance in that new chamorro language. It is not because we just barely learn and have sudden interest to understand this new group of people who happen to be our neighbors but the fact that we still hold out to some of our own Oral Historical account of the existence of that area and their history.

    In our Oral Historical Account, just like science our ancestors acknowledged that all these Micronesian Islands were empty and unoccupied. Kiribati was the very first visited Island groups that they sighted and inhabited then they move onto the next empty volcanic and coral islands: The Marshall Islands, Kosrae, Pohnpei then Chuuk Islands. After this, we move onto Yap and Palau and evidently we occupied their outer islands because they don't sail, they couldn't sail. Maybe you and science were right that the Phillipino occupied those islands and later the Gunea folks arrived and mixed up with them but their islands nearby remain empty and unvisited because they couldn't go around. Their culture, physiognomical and language were Melanesian similar to those pure blood gunea folks descendant of the aborigine. They're not so advance and yes now they have little canoes, the canoeing in the Melanesia was newly introduced to them after our existence and visitations to those areas not the other way around. That's why our existence shows in the Salomon islands and the fact that they are more similar to us and just happen to speak our language proves that we took it there not because we originated from there. After Waab (Yap) and PeiLau (Belau), we move up to the Marianas and with the same story. All the Marianas Islands were empty except Guam but Guam was different, the population wasn't the same compare to Yap and Palau. The people our ancestors discovered in Guam were a very small community, and that they live in caves and couldn't sail around either, they have no tools but does look like those Unearthed skeletal of Indonesian Java so it will be quite impossible to influence us (Caroline islanders) instead. Our Oral History have no little information or a single account of Phillipino or Indonesian ever sail upon our Micronesian territory only of them came upon Gunea Folks in Yap, Palau, Guam.

  • This may help you of why the now Chamorros and the DNA were extracted
    and studied from newly migrated Filipino after the genocide. The name of
    each and every single islands in the Marianas is in our Oral History
    because upon discovering and inhabiting those islands, we gave them
    names and name them just like we did from Kiribati all the way down to
    the outer islands, Waab, and PeiLau.

    This is more of a domestic
    issue in the Marianas so I expect you not to familiar with it. When the
    supposedly Chamorros trying to revive their supposedly dying culture,
    they realize the newly Carolinian arriving in the Marianas carrying the
    names and information of their islands. They realize that the names in
    the Marianas were named and given by us as our link to claim of first
    discovery and that's when we started to hear and introduced to a new
    name GUAHAN. The Government and the chamorros went to Saipan and request
    to the Carolinian organization there to allow them changing the name
    Saipan to another name from the Chamorros own word but like the
    Carolinian did before which caused them to be isolated away from Guam
    and pushed out to Saipan and the other islands, they refused because
    those names were historical and part of our culture and tradition that
    need to be preserved. The name of those islands were Carolinian Oceania
    language embedded into our Oral History along with our surviving
    Navigation System for Islands location and references. I cannot
    understand why they would retain the name of villages in Guam and just
    happen not to have their own names of their own Indonesian Islands???
    Also, does it not occur to you that the newly claims of identity and
    everything science said is another way of saying "we never sell or know
    the Marianas existed until Spaniard and Filipino got there? I won't be
    surprise if one of these days they'll claim they were the first one to
    discover the pure blooded chamorros and show the Carolinian the way and
    location to the Marianas. As if we stand isolated the whole time and go
    around the invisible Marianas awaiting the arrival of Magellan and the
    Spaniard/Portugal/Phillipino to somehow unleash a concealment of that
    region then we'll finally aware of their existence but limited only to
    Yap and Palau?....

    In regard to all their many similarities to
    the Indonesian Sunda-Sulawesi, those studies never make it to our
    islands so how can they declare and compare when they technically just
    studying to find the matching and common similarities rooted through the
    Austronesian Language and disregard our side of story??? I question the
    source/background of their extracted DNA and location and place of
    study in our Caroline Islands. I hope they don't base on the many
    mis-interpretation account of our area from people who came and try
    conduct study in the days of our strong tradition of never telling or
    spill sacred information to complete strangers. Evidently nowadays there
    are tons of misunderstanding and misinterpretation from those very few
    books collected from previous study.     
  • @Whoaml  Palau is a matrilineal society fyi.

    @kersamin been a pleasure reading the info you have provided in a number of different discussions. You carolinian? Anyways.. what do you mean by: finally aware of their existence but limited only to 
    Yap and Palau?

  • There are two types of Austronesians today. It is said that the pure Austronesians are what we know of as Polynesians, Eastern Micronesians, Malays, Indonesians, Taiwanese nd Malagasys. The second one would go for the Melanesians who inter-married with the Austronesians who would be known as Fijians, Palauans, Yapese nd many more island groups in Melanesia who inter-married with the Austronesians nd even borrowed the Austronesian languages.
  • @davincididit

    We were limited to only Yap and Palau to breed with them, trade and had cultural exchange with them for many decades but magically weren't able to see or ever had any idea there's such a place called Marianas filled with Indonesian until Magellan and the Spaniard drifted upon them. NOT NAVIGATING TO THEM but BLOWN BY TYPHOON and DRIFTED UPON THEM so that makes the great Navigators who could travel thousand miles from wherever upon Kiribati and all the way down till they met up with Yapese and Palauan whom science claimed were Phillipino mixed with Gunea Folks.

    That is my personal interpretation of the newly study of Marianas Existence. Pretty much plain and simple that our ancestors suck ass so bad, that they could never find the Marianas but limited only to Yap and Palau. They had to wait for I guess a prophecy of a blown off course Magellan to discover them first then out of nowhere we'll just finally introduce to that area much later, and that they were never Micronesian like us but pure Indonesian from Suwahili or whatever their name was.

  • lol ah i see. Man to my understanding (at least for yap, palau, and the carolines), our people have been there way before they crashed into our islands. I don't see how we could be populated and micronesia be empty. Esp with the Yapese, who have been sailing using the stars for hundreds of years. I know at least the palauans stayed put, we weren't much for sailing, Why would we anyways? We had everything we needed, large land mass, atolls, etc. Yapese would come to our island a lot trading various things for the stone money.

    This whole marshallese claims of dances and whatnot is just plain ignorant as well. Whoever wrote it is ignorant. 

    " Prior to marshallese introducing the stick dance in angaur in palau during the german era you guys had nothing but after marshallese performed it in angaur back in the late 1800's that's when you central carolinians started your watered down version of the jobwa." 

    Come to palau with that attitude and claim and you probably won't make it out, and that is the truth. Every island has their own culture and it came from within. We are not that different. Don't make ignorant claims on forums bashing the other cultures. 
  • Davinci our ancestors came out here before the vikings even started their sails thousands nd thousands of years ago. We met up with Melanesians nd some of us inter-married with them. Prior to that, we have exchanged language, culture nd arts. Though it is scientifically proven that they borrowed much of our austronesian language(note our number system) it is all similar to every austronesian dialects. From Madagascar to the west, Rapa Nui to East, Taiwan to the North nd Aotearoa to the South. The word for five is all but the same. The spelling may derive but its for sure it came from one source. The Austronesian language!!



  • i am just curious why most micro hip dancers used south pacific/foreign songs whenever performing hula

  • Its something we Austronesians have in common!! We can always relate to one anothers songs, music nd art. Like me,i love to listen to Pohnpeian, Kosrean nd Carolinian songs because i can obviously relate to them but then im Chuukese!! Lol same goes with our dances. One thing we all have in common is dance. We love to dance.!! Lol
  • Even during war, our ancestors would do some sort of dance in order to start. But in reality it was some sort of a dance to show the apponent what we are, where we come from nd what we can do.

    If yhu dnt like music nd dancing then yhu have lost that Austronesian touch of dancing nd
  • it makes sense when the mwashelis say they the roots of our language and culture here in kosrae-pohnpei and chuuk. The fisrt settlers lost their ways,they are the nauruans and kiribatese but now both these two islands are polynesians in every way and aspect even their language is classified has polynesian. What does that left us with? The marshalls are the only one in eastern micronesia other beside the kiribatese then nauruans that speak micronesians. They are the oldest of us micronesians. They are metralinial and still about all of the system of chiefly kingdoms still intact.. the chiefly system either in kosrae is no more,the chiefly system of pohnpei sarawi hold little sway and the chiefly system in chuuk is still fragmented but the chiefly system in the marshalls hold power and prestiege before their national government. By the way their navigational system is still intact and not has contaminanted has ours here in the carolines. The kiribatese lost their ways along with the nauruans and kosraens all that is left of the ancients are in the mwasjel. Why do you think the rohnrik nd rohnlhap are found in our legends here in pohnpei and chuuk? in yap they are also found in those legends. They have defeated both yapese and wolaens and satwalese fleet who sailed to their islands but we here in carolines have no legends have defeating them when they ccome to our islands. Their clans are found in all the 3 states of fsm and even in nauru and kiribat mwashelis clans are found but not our clans in their islands.
  • There is a conspiracy theory that the united states of america bombed their islands with nuclear weapons cause they were they most strongest of the people of micronesia. The bombings was a way for the imperialist white americans to weaken the strongest people in micronesia. Who of us micronesians have made a treaty with the westerners? Only the mwashelis are the one who are acredited with signing a treaty that gives them the advantantage. not in palau,not in guam,not in yap,not in chuuk,not in pohnpei,not in kosrae or kiribat or nauru,the only ones who signed a treaty of understanding with the whites are the mwashelis, that treaty was singned between the german emperor and their paramount chief. Only they can boast of signing a treaty with a western power. That's why the conspiracy theory goest that they were bombed to weaken their resolve and to kill the strongest people in micronesia. Now days its chuukese with their stabbings back then it was them with their strong will. Even witg 60 someting bombs but they still here and they outnumber the chuukese who are the most numerous in western micronesia. They remind of the isrealites.
  • imageso much studies to look into.
  • Interesting folu! 5 is eim in Palau! Thanks for the info folu! It kind of got me curious too so I looked up our languages and all are related but 2, Chamorro and Palauan smh! 

     And pawn, so what if they are matrilineal. I've said this before, so is Palau. We also still have our traditional chief system as well. So I'm not sure what your point it. Anyways, the yapese are generous in teaching others their navigational skills. In the end all we have is each other. I'm thankful for their generosity. Just a couple years ago some yapese came to palau and taught some palauans their navigational skills. My dad set out sail to saipan and made it in a couple days. Pretty dope if you ask me!
  • Welcome Davinci!! :))
  • Thanks! Pretty awesome site. Learning a lot more about my neighbors to the east that I ain't never know!
  • Be proud of where yhu come from!! Yhur ancestors came before we did.

    Scientifically proven.
  • Eh I don't care about any of that. Honestly, it was probably getting boring til my Yapese brothers showed up on the island! Every Palauan has a Yapese brother! I'm not sure of our history with the rest of Micronesia tho. I know we were kinda happy on our own at times and had our own internal wars to attend to. I was never really told many stories that had to do with the east.
  • I meant of who came first. Not too many ducks given regarding that but I am from melekeok, airai, and kayangel and I'm damn proud of it.
  • Wow! you eastern people have some serious issues. From Vikings to conspiracy theory, to we are the richest people because we nuke ourselves to get money and countless of reasons. What you people turn yourself into???
  • Im Chuukese from the island of Uman. I have an uncle that was adopted by Palauans, not sure of the family name that took him in.
  • @TDJake

    I believe what you have said...chamorro dance are so lame and dont even know what they are dancing about...all they did in the past was chanting....AND NOTHING ELSE...HAWAIIANS DANCE IS THE SAME...HAWAII AND CHAMORRO DANCE ARE CRAPPY
  • Lol... Ive seen it!!
  • @folu nice. he live in palau or grow up there?
  • edited June 2014
    Hawaiian dances actually look nice to me, but Chamorro dances. Nooooo. Looks fake and wannabe. The people who made-up the dances even admit that they're not authentic. It's just crap for the tourists to watch and make them think they're in Hawaii 
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