From Hawaii Parent Information Resource Center to All Chuukese Parents

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  • Is diz a draft? Dude, we, Chuukese should be offended!! Wrong spelling and brokendo. Hehe

    Thanks for the effort...
  • Child_Justice, i thought it was alright. were do you learn proper usage of written chuukese lingo. o my goodness.
  • Islanders have a correct way to spell things? I thought it was all done phonetically, seems that many people spell things however they want..
  • Okay, my bad! Did not know that Chuukese alphabets do have ys. Sorry, Ponira!!!

    Aloha
  • Mwa ennet ... ennet kapasen Chuuk kei.... Iwe pwe inet ei a wor ei eew minefon itekich nge ennet kumwaimwai ngang ren.

    Ttong Chaaywaak (Tong Chaiwak).
    Keep it simple don't follow the phonetic rules otherwise you are making our lingo too WESTERNIZE.

    Congrats. on the effort and initiating such projects like this.

    EC
  • e-Cast, first of all, we shall thank the initiator of this project for such caring & thoughtful project.
    Second, we must kindly bring to the attention of the project initiator that this is a VERY poorly written document!! It is true that we, Chuukese, do write phonotically using the correct Chuukese alphabets!!! Professionally, no none-chuukese spelling should be used except when one is using "borrowed" chuukese words. Borrowed chuukese words are not used often... I would like to urge Speedo Transactions, a Micronesian owned language company to please follow up on this project & professionally point out the errors.


    This is a really poorly written Chuukese document, the material is very simple, but the spelling and alphabets used are sooooo not proper Chuukese. And the person also failed to observe/ follow professional translation protocol!!

    Fairo, kindly reclaim your work & redo them, please.
  • edited June 2011
    I would like to accolade the respected and knowledgable people from Chuuk for the intitative and creativity of preserving your language. I am a classroom teacher and I would like to tip in something from a teacher's perspective to enhance the preservation of our languages. When language, along with cultural wisdom and pride, are no longer passed down to the next generation, children-and our society as a whole-lose something. The richly diverse cultural and familial traditions of our own country, and the intergenerational wisdom that is imbedded in them, are all being lost. Yet these could serve us well in our struggle with some of the complex social issues that face us. When language and culture are preserved, and children learn pride in which they are and respect for one another, the collaborative wisdom of our nation's diverse cultures will help us solve problems together for generations to come. As teachers of our youngest children, there are two basic areas we need to explore in order to help preserve the traditions of all the children in our care. First, we need to examine our own personal attitudes about languages and cultures, since these attitudes will be mirrored in our classrooms. Second, we need to examine our classroom practices to make sure they support the best interests of children from either linguistically diverse or monolingual families. The existence or disappearance of languages has particular political and economic implications for native peoples themselves.


    With Respect,

    Asaf
  • I really do not mean to be critical, but this document is so far the most "disrespectful" piece of Chuukese translation that I came across...

    The person failed not only to correctly write in Chuukese, but also many major failures on following professional translation protocol.

    I really am trying to be sensitive about this doc. But it is such a "major" fail....

    Weeew! Fairoooo
  • ACH_FENGEN,

    Please note that I did acknowledged their effort and initiation on such language documentation project. All I hope is that they use a spelling system that is commonly used by Chuukese. I do aware that Chuuk does not have a "ONE CORRECT" writing and spelling system but I do hope that we would not take two steps further into the writing system that was created by foreign linguistics, who had the opportunity to put our language at the lens of a microscope.

    Kan pwal tirow omw ika ee mwanino ititin kapasen memefin netipach. Know that I am proud of such effort that HPIRC put together.

    Kinisow sefan,

    EC
  • Mwa meet mwaa.. uufeen kirooch nnon chamwei eyi ren eyi new spelling..
  • E-Cast, yes, you did! There is more than one way to write in Chuukese. The most acceptable one is the one that is commonly used by every Chuukese, that is not customized to a specific region. One that used in spoken form by more than one region.

    What stood out most to me in this document is the wrong spellings, e.g y, double n, & etc.

    I am not going to try to do a free class on professional translation on here, but I am going to point out the fact that many Chuukese (young& old) do prefer the common spellings w/out symbols... The pronunciation of the words is determined by how they are being used in the sentences.

    This document, if it has not been distributed yet, should be recalled and redone!
    I do understand that the younger generation have formed some new spellings.. But being that this is a professional document for a divervse group (region & age wise)... The translator must use the MOST common form of spelling/translation.

    Many parents who did not either finish, or even gone to western style teaching school would be a bit lost, if not totally lost!!

    Fairo
  • I know and many of you are going she is correcting & her grammar is kindergarden!! Um, translation from English as the source language into target language, Chuukese is different...

    A ina chok!! Please do not ever do this kind of translstion everrr again. Geez
  • Child_Justice,

    It sounds like you are using two cyber names--- CJ and AF? Ika pwe en chok emon nge ruuw itach, iwe kinisow pwe en mei faateoch ngeni memefich. Kich mei kinisow ren pekus mei tou me aforean angang mei ochuuw fengeni ei project.

    EC
  • Why "sikun". The outer island people spell it as it sounds "sukul". When and who determines the official spelling of the Chuukese language? Just thought I'd ask.
  • E-Cast, apw! Mi mwan! Ese wor namoten fori ika ese pwung foforun. Enna om just being Chuukese. Pokiten a ekis ianan ach tufich ren ei pekin, mei och upwe affata ngonuk nge ese acceptable ei standard. Ika pwe the initiator of the project has been made aware of all that I have just pointed out, he/she will be very makus and get on the case of the company that did this!

    Most likely, a company was contracted to do this and that company should have done everything in its power to ensure a good product... It is a big deal to me cuz I am familiar w/ the process of such projects. Professionally, this should have never made it to the print shop w/out an editor... Use sinei ika pwata epwe ien usun ngawan foforun, nge ururun ion e fori, mi kamo.

    Sisapw sufonungaw! Esapw iei ururun met epwe kawor ngeni atongeach kewe rese nien wewefichiti kapasen Merika. Moni mi kawor ngeni ekkei neni pwe repwe ensure pwe LES have the same equal access/ understanding ren ekkei mettoch, usun chok emon native speaker. Esapw wewen nge they did it out if the goodness of their hears. Apw! Ew standard ... Met namoten onusa moni ika ese pwung foforun! Ei a wewe ngeni om no kamo onomw kon non market, nge ra ngonuk kon mi nofit uch, nge rese pwan affata ngonuk.


    A mo wes! Fairo

    Fairo,
  • Download, those are special skills and trainings... you are asking! I kindly refuse to reply to ur inquiry... In the interest of protecting my "intellectual properties".

    A nap kapas, those who know what to do, will take care of it.

    Aloha
  • CJ, I am not sure if I was asking about anybody's "intellectual properties". What I wanted to know is if there is a Chuukese official language (spelling and all) that should be used uniformly. If there is, then that's what the writer should be using, to be politically correct. I know, the Chuukese spelling in this document is a bit confusing, but I admire the time and the effort these people put through, to assit the Chuukese living outside of Chuuk, to deal with the challenges of their new found world. Now all they have to do is go out and educate and train the users on how to utilize this document. There is room for modification and improvement but at least there is something in place. Just my two cents.
  • Ewer kinisou! Omusano ren wanengaw, sisapw men kan sinei fichi nounoun kapas esapw ukutumw ngeni om auchean tufich... Again, let me clarify that the initiator of this project bought a defected product! Will you present a defected product to your customers? I hope not. Same concept, my friend... Diz is biz in & biz out. I am complaining, but I should also acknowledge the fact that I have "left" interpretation/translation couple months back... But, still there about 2 other interpreters/translators who are familiar w/ this kind of work...

    My point is, do not waste time and resouces doing something you are not 100% certain of...

    To answer your question who decides what is the correct Chuukese spelling... Dats something professionals would know. This doc. Was not written in correct Chuukese alphabets, dats is the major flaw of this one, beside other error. Yes, I do appreciate the effirt, but it is an dishonest effort. This is not Europe, where there is not that many Micronesians to tap... It is easier said than done! If this doc. Has already been send out to parents, then it is too late!!!! Sad but datz the reality of such work. Bringing dis to the attention of the project initiator will be for future use & knowledge.

    Do not firget, this was made for all the islands in the Hawaiian Island Chains...all schools in Hawaii utilize this doc.

    Omusano, ua mo tou... Correcting it is impossible at this point. At least in hard copies...
  • Excuse da spelling errors, kindly. My iPhone & my pinky should be blamed for it.
  • Me thinks it was done this way to allow non native chuukese speakers to pronounce the words easily.
  • edited June 2011
    CJ

    As Chuukese, we must acknowledge a work and point out the needs for improvement, especially when it concerns "CHUUK". Even better, we need to point them to the resources that they could use to reference their work. Part of our problem is that we lack one official standard for spelling. What is quiet accepted by academia in terms of linguistics, is the Trukese-English Dictionary written by Dr. Goodenough. Sadly, that dictionary follows the rules of phonetics transcriptions, which pay close attention to the placement of articulators when producing a sound. HPIRC follows that system used in the published dictionary perhaps for some reasons- (1) to defend them when it comes to identifying the correct way of spelling and (2) to protect them from producing different version of the same text in different dialects--- respecting the fact that Chuukese is spelled base on how it is pronounced in a dialect.

    Until, we have "ONE CORRECT" spelling system or a new dictionary with all the corrections, then and only then, we will treat such this kind of efforts as an insult and disrespect to our language and culture. By then, we will stop recognizing the efforts of those that that die trying.

    In the meantime, Is there a way that you and the others professionals in that area assist us in voicing the needs for a correct standard or standards for spelling? I don't really care if it is in different dialects or "ONE" but I hope that we have "some kind" of standard.

    Respectfully,

    EC
  • This is not the same version that was originally done. Those were much more dialect neutral. All of us with some education know that right now we do not have a perfect Chuukese spelling but we can try to be as neutral as possible. This version is a mess and very little use to anyone. Get this offline and burn the copies! Contact the Sunday Project at Toll Free Number: 1-877-99H-PIRC (994 -7472) E-mail: info@hawaiipirc.org and tell them your concerns. They need to know they are being a dis-service to the community.
  • Kinisou chapur ngeni ekkei memmef mei tou seni pwisin kich chon fonuwach Chuuk, fan itan met mei kawor seni ei pekin aninnis a affat won ei nenien porous.

    Upwe pwan fiti kemi meinisin ne apasa ai kinisou fiti mwareiti ei pekin aninnis mei awora ekkei aninnis fan itan kich chon Chuuk, sam me in ika nouch kewe.

    Nge ngang mei pwan fiti kemi ekkei u watiw mefiemi ami ouse tipeu ngeni ekkei napanapan mak ekkei aninnis a nounou ren ekkoch popun:

    Aewin, ika pwe sipwe fori ei aninnis fan itan aninisin ekkewe sam me in, iwe mei auchea sipwe kutta ewe napanapan mak meinisin repwe weweiti. Pwun iei fen ei aewin popun ei aninnis a kawor; EPWE ANISI OSUPWANGEN SAM ME IN WON EI FONU HAWAII IKA MERIKA. Ina minne epwe fen weweoch ach sipwe chok mak non ei napanapan mak napengeni kich chon Chuuk sia fen kukkuna. A pwa non nouch kewe Bible. iei ngang u aea.

    Aruwan, ngeni kich chon Chuuk. Nupwen sia kan kokko ngeni ekkei sakkun aninnis epwe wene ngeni unusen aramasen Chuuk, iwe mei fakkun namwot sipwe kutta ekkewe kinikinin aramasen chuuk repwe angang fengen non sakkun miritin aninnis. Pwun nupwen chommong mokur ika tiip repwe angang fengen, iwe repwe tongeni achufengeni sakkun mirit minne repwe kawor fan itan mwirinon ewe mwichen aramas.

    Tumunu sisapw chok angang fan itan ewe mettoch 'moni' nge sia monuki pwe ewe 'end product' epwe fan itan unusen ewe mwichen aramasen Chuuk.

    Amusano tipisin mefiei,
  • Mei fokkun pwung ren inach ei Margarita. Epwe wor aninis fengen pwun epwe napono mwurinon kiich aramasen Chuuk...Ai memmef ngeni ion a fori ei project! Fokkun kinisow chapwur ren omw watten aninis minne mi pwa non omw ei angang. Iwe nge ach tungor ngonuk, kose mwochen kopwe fori non met mei weweoch, non met kiich mi miriti nge epwe ina usun, me met sia fen aea fengen me wewefengeniti usun kiich aramasen Chuuk.
  • My fellow Chuukese, I can see you all are coming at this from a pure Chuukese stand point, disregarding standards of professional translators. THIS IS NOT AN ACCEPTABLE PRODUCT!! Accept that fact and people will come to realize that we do have a standard Chuukese alphabets... all these things that you all are saying on here are encouraging this kind of "dishonest efforts". There is a Chuukese "acceptable standard" that has been used in many different documents by HDOE. For someone like me who have spent respectable amounts of hours and efforts to ensure that I provide quality product to the service providers and their customers, I find this kind of work disgusting!!! Same thing with INTERPRETATION... WE ALL ARE GETTING THE SAME PAY, WHEN OTHERS ONLY SHOW UP TO STAND BY DEFENDANTS TO REPEAT THIS PHRASE, "KA MA PUSIN WEWEITI, AH" that is not interpretation!!! It all comes down to integrity of those Chuukese & non-Chuukese who want to assist the Chuukese Communities. I would understand if the person is not getting paid for this service... the spelling used in this document was off the wall!! I have utilized this spelling in some of my work, without adding different letters that are not in the Chuukese alphabets. USING THIS SPELLING IS OKAY, BUT IF THIS PERSON IS AN EXPERIENCE ONE, HE/SHE WOULD KNOW THAT HER AUDIENCE DO PREFER THE SIMPLE CHUUKESE WRITING that is understood by all regardless of their background... There are standards used by professional translators, that one would know what is wrong and what needs to be used.

    Enough discussion on this matter, JUST KNOW THAT FROM A PROFESSIONAL TRANSLATOR STAND POINT, THIS DOCUMENT IS A SIGN OF DISRESPECT TO THE CHUUKESE COMMUNITY!! Yes, I said that! There are standards and procedures in this kind of field that the project initiator and service provider disregarded and came out with such a poor PRODUCT.

    For someone who has done this kind of work for some time, I would humbly tell you that even those with respectable educational background have also provided wrong interpretation cuz they simply do not know the protocol and procedures...! This is not by choice but it is due to their ignorance to the standards of translations... there is a lot more involved in translation of a document, it is not simply looking at the target document and doing the translation, it involves more. For Chuukese language, this is very true cuz there is no "official" dialect that we have as the state's one, but I WILL PRESENT TO YOU THAT THERE IS A STANDARD ONE THAT IS ACCEPTABLE ... CONSIDERING THE PROFESSIONAL TRANSLATIONS STANDARDS.

    This is my last point on this one and I am going to tap couple key people in the community to help in preventing this from happening in the future. For the record again, THIS IS NOT AN ACCEPTABLE PRODUCT! This is coming from an experience professional Chuukese translator.

    Fairo, aloha
  • I am going to inform you e-Cast and those that are praising this document that I am going to the the following:

    1. Contact the service provider and ask them to remove this document from online ASAP.

    2. Offer "FREE SERVICE" TO CORRECT THIS MESS!

    3. Offer them standard and procedures to follow for any future needs.

    4. Collect names of Chuukese translators to offer them tips on doing right translations. THIS WILL BE A PAID SERVICE. Invest in your biz. Do not do something for the money ONLY. Do it cuz you can provide the service they are after...

    Fairo, sipwe ennetin fotupasuk non ach sipwe aninis ne awenfichi ei mettoch mi aforea... pwan fairo an epwe ne nikinikin nge sia kan pusin kuningekich, nge sia pusin tamenios ren mwokutun ei muun ikenai. Fairo sefan non ach ennetin sufoniti ami mirit me tufich. Sipwe tingor nge sipwe kan ennet fengen non ach sipwe anisi atongeach kewe rese men sinei kapasen Merika. Chuukese typical reaction, ina ekkoch repwe ne... fakkun pwan mochen chok nge epwe pwano om sinne. Apw i, omusano ren ach epipii mwen mesom me non om ekiek, nge sipwe achocho ne fiti met ururun pungun mwokutun ekkei muu sia nikopin non. Sefaniti, fairo non pwetete pwan kan ennetin omusano ach tipis...

    The target audience is Chuukese parents. Your reasoning about using different spellings to enable non-chuukese to read the document is simply ludicrous! Just say the person messed up. kinisou

    aloha,

    Cj
  • "Áán Saam me Iin Ttong ina Áán Néwúch kkewe Epinúkúnúk"

    Kinisou ngeni ioei e fokun ani ei angang weires pun auwa weweiti ika pun kei metoch re wesesen for non kapasen ekis nge iei emon nei akan tiransineit ngeni fosun fonuach...
    ekis chok mefiei
    usun efen kumochumowch newenewen kana fos mei tatapwon kana mesen mak non usun nge mei fen ke'e' awei... heheh
    nokun oumwo pwan anisi ei? pwata mwo apwan wor ei mesen Y, merei chok nge ita eise pwan ii nonounou.
  • haha, brother Ate! Ina pwata sisapw ita sufonungaw sia era, ra pekus, INA CHOK! Apw, FYI, THE PERSON WHO DID THIS GOT PAID FOR IT! He/she provided a defected product.

    Nge pwan kan kapong me fairo ngeni en semeinan atin nomunsofo! aloha
  • This is an embarrassment! Our language is being written and endorsed by a foreigner. Shows we do not have a Chuukese linguist or the support and endorsement by the government to set a official spelling and usage of the chuukese language.

    So we can all "hoo" and "haa", the fact is that because there is no standard written chuukese, foreign linguists are patterning our language phonetic after the western alphabetic system.

    Who gave these people, listed below the right and authority to have any translation rights? Just because one can speak it, does not mean that he or she is literate enough to translate the language.
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